Sibling Rivalry

This is a public forum allowing posting as a guest.
Message
Author
Sibling Rivalry
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Sibling Rivalry

#1 Post by Sibling Rivalry »

Going anon for this. I have two children DD17 and DS14. They absolutely despise each other and it's gone so bad now that DD is wanting to move out of home to live with her grandparents.

From the moment DS was born DD was insanely jealous and it has only gotten worse throughout the years. They are very different and have absolutely nothing in common and you know that's fine.

I've accepted the fact that they will never be friends and life is easier when they are just not together. DH just can't accept it all and thinks we've raised a monster in DD. She is very hard, cold, shows very little emotion, except anger, I don't think she has every apologised once in her life. She is focused, hard working and extremely driven for her age. She has always been more mature in her years and yes we probably spoiled her a bit but nothing out of the ordinary and not anymore than DS. She thinks DS is manipulating and gets away with murder. However DS is the one when he is wrong will apologise and say he's sorry.

DS is the typical teenage boy at the moment, can be all mouth and not very pleasant. DD said she can't stand the way he talks to us, that he is let away with murder etc.. But she cannot see that sometimes her behaviour is actually worse. We were out on a walk yesterday and DD made it very clear that when we got to a certain section she did not want to be seen with us and she couldn't see how that was wrong and hurtful.

Going back to DH he has no relationship with his siblings all 7 of them. There is zero communication from them and he has cut them out of his life, yet at the same time he thinks that his own children should be different. I don't have a close relationship with my siblings and we killed each other growing up.

If they don't have a close relationship I don't mind as long as both are happy.

I don't know if DD needs to have some counselling to deal with some of her anger issues, I'm kind of at a loss at the moment as to what to do. It all seems to be falling apart at the moment. DH tends to give up and want to throw in the towel and his suggestion is always to to up sticks and move and as I've pointed out to him you are just moving the problem but not sorting it. Or he could also just walk away from the family. He's a typical man in that he doesn't discuss his emotions. At the moment I feel like I'm the only one holding it together and just don't know where to go and what to do.

mcmammy2
Posts: 3018
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2016 10:31 am
Has thanked: 36 times
Been thanked: 71 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#2 Post by mcmammy2 »

Do they ever get on? Counselling sounds like a sound option it may help your dd to understand her feelings towards her brother. I have no experience with family counseling but I wonder would that help everyone understand each other better. It could be worth ringing a counselor and seeing what they suggest whether individual or family counselling would be the best option. Hopefully someone better versed than me on the subject will come along.

I hope it works out for you and your family as it is sad when they don't all get along swimmingly. I have one who just lives for upsetting the other two and it really affects everyone. My DC are younger so we are focussing on promoting the positive interactions as much as possible and keeping them separate as much as possible too.

Stripy
Posts: 625
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2019 8:35 pm
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 10 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#3 Post by Stripy »

I think it would be worth you contacting a counsellor to talk it through. As Mums we are often holding it all together and at the brunt of everyone's bad humour, anger etc. I was at the end of my tether a few months ago - siblings similar age killing each other, DH flying off the handle and blaming everyone but himself. I contacted counsellor- free through work and even 1 session really helped me. You could get some guidance as to what direction to take. You have my absolute sympathy, you sound like you are really doing your best.

Grasscutter
Posts: 6775
Joined: Fri May 06, 2016 1:26 pm
Has thanked: 42 times
Been thanked: 91 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#4 Post by Grasscutter »

I’d agree it’s you who needs counselling - as a support. No point sending your DD unless it’s her decision - she’s practically an adult. And that famous phrase - you can’t change others but you can change how you react to them. Sounds like a very very tough position for you to be in and you’re carrying the entire emotional burden. Counselling could help and you deserve help. But BTW I think your DD’s attitude of not wanting to be seen with her family in public can be fairly normal for a lot of teens at that age and none of them ever sees that it’s hurtful so I don’t think that demonstrates that’s she’s mean at all. Sibling rivalry is a bitch though. I absolutely hate it. And I know you say you’ve made peace with the fact they might never get along but I don’t believe it doesn’t hurt. It has to. You love both of them.
These users thanked the author Grasscutter for the post:
cm1980

purple star
Posts: 13467
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:54 pm
Has thanked: 93 times
Been thanked: 28 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#5 Post by purple star »

I've a boy and girl and I would hate to think they would not be close as adults. I would find it hard to accept. I think it's more important because there are only the two of them.
I've no advice really but just to say they may not get on as teens but may well click as adults. You might just have to weather the storm.

Joanne12
Posts: 670
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 6:11 pm
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#6 Post by Joanne12 »

I think family counselling could be very useful here if you were able to arrange it. The focus would be on how the family members relate to each other within the family unit and helping each of you understand your own behaviour and how/why others behave as they do. You might well have to start with initial counselling for yourself and your DH and then in time extend it to include your two children. I too would find it difficult to imagine having siblings with such strong negative feelings and I don't think I could just accept that for what it is. It is interesting that your DH has no contact with his siblings and you mention that you are not close with your own. I really think a counsellor could be a great help here if you can find someone good/that you click with. Best of luck with it all.

Tobo
Posts: 5439
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 12:25 pm
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 28 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#7 Post by Tobo »

I'm so sorry to read this, you sound extremely stressed at the situation, I wouldn't blame you btw.
I would imagine your DH doesn't want his children to be in the situation he is in now, with no communication with his siblings. Is there any way he could sit down with the pair of them and explain his reasoning and his history between his family?
While my dad was close to some siblings, he wasn't with others, just happens sometimes with large families. He was always making us aware that there was only two of us, myself and my sibling. That he didn't want us fighting or loosing touch when he was dead. (We got on somewhat, large age gap, as much as siblings do when younger), but it always really bothered him, up to weeks before he died.
I would imagine your DH feels somewhat the same. I wouldn't dismiss him from looking for that. It must be hard for him to be alone although having lots of siblings.
Your DD may well need some counselling with her jealousy and anger, if she's always been that way I would imagine hormones has little to do with it, moreso a trait she has.
Your DS is probably sick of your DD, I know DS here, the eldest, just can't be arsed with his sisters if their stroppy. He tends to eye roll, but at the same time he's always there for them.
Sorry I've no advice really, but I'd imagine a family meeting with no sulking off needs to be had. Your DH needs to make his emotions and feelings clear. Counselling seems to be a good option, both for your DD and as a family.

Sibling Rivalry
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#8 Post by Sibling Rivalry »

Almost 3 months on and things have only gotten worse. Major row between the two of them tonight. DD was the instigator, however she cannot see this in any shape or form. She just cannot help herself she just winds up DS constantly. He's now bigger than her and far stronger and I'm just worried it's going to end up really bad someday. It did end up in a physical route tonight DS just couldn't hold his temper any longer and lashed out of course she retaliated and there was blue murder.

We took them out separately to trying to talk to each of them about the situation but DD refused to acknowledge she's in the wrong. She told us how much she hates all of us including us her parents. This is just not the normal I hate you stuff. She actually packed a bag and left to go to her grandmother's house.

We also sat with DS and had a long chat with him, I can reason with him he understands that he was wrong to retaliate and hit her but also expressed anger that she constantly pushes his buttons and is so nasty to him that he's trying his hardest to stop he stays in his room all day just to avoid being in the same room as her.

I've started counseling for myself as I think I'm going to crack up. DH is really worried about me and thinks they're going to drive me to an early grave. I have health issues and he's pretty worried about the effect it's all having on me.

Grasscutter
Posts: 6775
Joined: Fri May 06, 2016 1:26 pm
Has thanked: 42 times
Been thanked: 91 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#9 Post by Grasscutter »

You poor thing. I think teenage girls can often have a real gift for nastiness and button pressing when they want to. Had a humdinger with one of my DDs recently and it’s so emotionally draining. I really hope the counselling helps. It sounds like your DD could really benefit from some too but she may not agree.

CocoRose
Posts: 12807
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 11:29 pm
Has thanked: 76 times
Been thanked: 143 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#10 Post by CocoRose »

Hey. It's good you are getting counselling. Would the grandmother have her? If so, I'd send her off for a few weeks for some calm. I know that sounds dramatic but why not? You all need a break from her. You need respite, I'd take it.
These users thanked the author CocoRose for the post:
MaudGonne

Deeda
Posts: 4515
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:18 pm
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 14 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#11 Post by Deeda »

That sounds so stressful, glad to hear you have started counselling - I really hope that helps.

I remember hearing years ago that an age gap of 2.5 to 3.5 years is the hardest for the older child, they remember a time without the sibling but aren’t old enough to be excited by their arrival and see any benefits. It sounds like your guys might have that age gap, so some of your DDs anger might stem from early childhood - she might benefit from counselling too, but she’ll need to want to do it. It might be useful to see if there are any other methods/techniques she could be exposed to to try to get to explore her feelings.

From what you have described with your DH and yourself, they probably don’t have much visibility of functioning adult sibling relationships so they probably don’t see any value in having a relationship - if you could spend time with any adult siblings you know it might help their perspective.

Is the grandmother an ally for you guys in this? Does she mind that her adult children have no relationship and was that partly due to her playing them off against each other or factors beyond her control? No need to answer, just have a think about that maybe.

Rita
Posts: 12078
Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2014 2:20 pm
Has thanked: 14 times
Been thanked: 73 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#12 Post by Rita »

Will her grandmother keep her a while? Give you space.

How is your dd elsewhere ? Does she get on with people easily or is she argumentive. Would you think she would also go to counselling

RDR
Posts: 14376
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2017 10:06 am
Has thanked: 124 times
Been thanked: 139 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#13 Post by RDR »

Rita wrote: Tue Aug 24, 2021 12:59 pm Will her grandmother keep her a while? Give you space.
This might really help if an option.

How long are you looking at them both being at home? When will your dd finish school? Will she want to go to college and could that be in a different county (ie that she moves out)?

If the relationship can't be fixed salvaging your sanity should be priority and maybe distance and space is needed (that is assuming she behaves reasonably with other people like her grandmother).

Kensington
Posts: 5765
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 4:06 pm
Has thanked: 15 times
Been thanked: 269 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#14 Post by Kensington »

I think counselling for you is probably the best thing at the moment. If your dd could spend some time with her grandmother, it might also relieve the tension for a bit. I would hate that though - would hate to lose a child to another home but it may be the best approach. If they don't have a relationship as adults, that isn't the worst thing ever.

I don't mean to upset you by sayinbg this, but it seems to me you and her father clearly see your daughter as the cause of all the tension in the house and you don't sound like you like her very much. I'm sure she is horrible to her brother but lets face it he was physical with her last night and it sounds from what you wrote that you see her wrongdoing as far worse. The thing is she will know how you feel - she definitely will have picked up on it and will know that you think her brother is the easier nicer child. I can completely see your problem and how stressful it is - her behaviour is awful so you don't like it and she then picks up on that and she behaves worse. Is there any way you could have family therapy with her - where someone can moderate between you and maybe help her feel listened to or even validated in how she feels.
These users thanked the author Kensington for the post:
Apple

janeymac
Posts: 7027
Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2014 3:16 pm
Has thanked: 146 times
Been thanked: 230 times

Re: Sibling Rivalry

#15 Post by janeymac »

Kensington wrote: Tue Aug 24, 2021 6:45 pm
I don't mean to upset you by sayinbg this, but it seems to me you and her father clearly see your daughter as the cause of all the tension in the house and you don't sound like you like her very much. I'm sure she is horrible to her brother but lets face it he was physical with her last night and it sounds from what you wrote that you see her wrongdoing as far worse. The thing is she will know how you feel - she definitely will have picked up on it and will know that you think her brother is the easier nicer child. I can completely see your problem and how stressful it is - her behaviour is awful so you don't like it and she then picks up on that and she behaves worse.
I thought the same reading the op posts.
I could see how your dd might feel you favour your ds. You seem to be a lot more understanding towards your ds. Even when he got physical with her, you blamed her for pushing him to it. And I do understand that the tongue can be a terribly hurtful weapon too.
I think I would try to stop laying the blame on her all the time, even when you think she is to blame.I think I would try and hold my tongue myself. If they row, I think I'd try and defuse it without apportioning blame. If they fight a lot, and she is generally seen as the one in the wrong, then there is a lot of negativity coming her way. No wonder she is angry.
You said your dh thinks you have reared a monster, she's cold, hard etc... Very harsh words about your 17 year old child. You can bet she has picked up on this and knows what he thinks. Sometimes people respond to hurt with anger. I know as a teenager I did. So I wouldn't be surprised that she is angry.
It sounds very tough for everyone but I think it sounds like you should give your dd a break, even if you don't think she deserves it. Cut back on the negativity towards her and try overlooking her nastiness for a while. She doesn't sound like she is liked by her family and no matter how hard a face she puts on, that has got to hurt.
Fwiw- not wanting to be seen with your parents I think is a fairly normal teenage thing! I think the onus is on the grown up not to make something out of it that it's not.
These users thanked the author janeymac for the post:
Kensington

Post Reply

Return to “Advice/Anon”